Domestic Noise

[adult human]

I don't think it has to be that specific here? The thread just seems to be about a general vibe/aesthetic and they just picked "domestic" as a sort-of-representative descriptor. In a deeper critical context I think specificity would be useful, but that's true of anything. I don't think we risk a "codification of style and approach" if we're just recommending stuff that kind of sounds like other stuff and trying to trace out some commonalities across different scenes or eras.

Completely, which is why I'm back peddling out of the overthinking in my last post. It's fun to dissect these things but then time passes and you can see from a distance how little you've achieved in doing it. Don't mistake any of it for challenges, just mapping out ideas in public, semi-embarrassingly. The closest thing I have to a justification or purpose for all the dialectics is that to discuss the nature of the commonalities you mention hopefully oils the cogs of the recommendations a bit more. In any case this is some of the most engaged and in depth chat I've ever seen anywhere about a lot of these artists. Only a good thing, even if it takes going round the houses a bit to get to the good stuff.

[snowdrops]

Just remembered Encoder, Noise from the Deep

[informalreleases]

adding my little grain of salt to this great thread

from what i get reading the thread, the big question is the "domestic" term, or what it means in a musical context (and the second question seems to be the second term, "noise", as in what is acceptable as noise, which the "domestic" part asks us to reconsider). from the thread, i get 4 different domesticities: material domesticity (it is recorded using what's at home -- diy?), thematic domesticity (it is about home), auditory/acousmatic domesticity (it sounds domestic), contextual/environmental domesticity (when played at home, it incorporates its listener's surroundings).

the last category, the contextual one, hits close to home. for the past year i've been fascinated with the interactions between music and its listening environment. for me it's one of the big missing pieces in (harsh) noise: it has become its own context, and so the environment is not questioned, drowned out, a nuisance (at least, for me listening to harsh noise and hearing someone passing the vacuum is a total killjoy). integrating the context also means working with silence, how noise can restructure the silence (or what's heard during the silence).

if we talk about "noise that incorporates its own (domestic) listening context", the best things i've found is the scene around labels Zooming Night and musician Yan Jun. the good thing is music is also made from domestic, or hyper DIY, material.

sleepings https://sleepingsorg.bandcamp.com/
a label run by yan jun which is as domestic as it gets: recordings of people sleeping.

yan jun - would you stay here forever https://amplify2020.bandcamp.com/album/ ... re-forever
my entry point into the domestic sounds. the release is part of amplify 2020, a festival (by the folks of Erstwhile / Elsewhere labels, i think?) made during the Covid lockdown, by artists under lockdown. so the whole thing is pretty domestic. i listened to some releases on loop during lockdown, adding to the feeling of "shared isolation". all releases are very much worth checking out !

zhao cong - gear, gear https://zoominnight.bandcamp.com/album/gear-gear
both hyper focused and imprevisible, unstructured, at times hyper silent, and then reaching The Rita levels of density.

as soon as you start listening to your environment when you listen to music (and incorporating the future listening context when recording), i'd say that the music questions what you're listening to (the music, the context), and what position is the listener in. you feel more grounded, present, when you listen to something that forces you to acknowledge your material surroundings. for me, it's Gabi Losoncy's work that conveys these feelings the strongest (or at least, what i know of her work). what i've heard from her is just one-take recordings from her phone (saw her play live in paris, she was just playing back something on her phone, recorded on her phone, more of an anti-performance than Vomir). when listening, i know that i know the sounds i hear, but i can't tell from where i know the sounds. this kind of myopy to your surroundings, it doesn't get more domestic than that : )

gabi losoncy, tact is a muscle https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nciKHSGpunE
very, very textural, yet very very domestic (as in, the sounds sound like something you've known forever)

gabi losoncy, security besides love https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s1WGxCamtIw

her release on Lake Shark Harsh Noise is absolutely stunning, both the artwork and the sound, one of the most fascinating releases i've heard in the past years.

finally, not so much domestic, but in the "incorporating its surroundings" and general "informalness" of the sound, jackson pratt's part of his split with shredded nerve (https://www.discogs.com/fr/release/2606 ... dded-Nerve) is very much worth checking out !

(end of the rant. i hope i made some sense / added something to this thread. btw: joined the forum recently, it has been years since i last went on a forum and it is so refreshing to see some actual talk about music online !)

[James Thompson]

just chiming in to say great post, loads of interesting stuff to explore - cheers for sharing!

[SS1535]

adding my little grain of salt to this great thread

from what i get reading the thread, the big question is the "domestic" term, or what it means in a musical context (and the second question seems to be the second term, "noise", as in what is acceptable as noise, which the "domestic" part asks us to reconsider). from the thread, i get 4 different domesticities: material domesticity (it is recorded using what's at home -- diy?), thematic domesticity (it is about home), auditory/acousmatic domesticity (it sounds domestic), contextual/environmental domesticity (when played at home, it incorporates its listener's surroundings).

the last category, the contextual one, hits close to home. for the past year i've been fascinated with the interactions between music and its listening environment. for me it's one of the big missing pieces in (harsh) noise: it has become its own context, and so the environment is not questioned, drowned out, a nuisance (at least, for me listening to harsh noise and hearing someone passing the vacuum is a total killjoy). integrating the context also means working with silence, how noise can restructure the silence (or what's heard during the silence).

if we talk about "noise that incorporates its own (domestic) listening context", the best things i've found is the scene around labels Zooming Night and musician Yan Jun. the good thing is music is also made from domestic, or hyper DIY, material.

sleepings https://sleepingsorg.bandcamp.com/
a label run by yan jun which is as domestic as it gets: recordings of people sleeping.

yan jun - would you stay here forever https://amplify2020.bandcamp.com/album/ ... re-forever
my entry point into the domestic sounds. the release is part of amplify 2020, a festival (by the folks of Erstwhile / Elsewhere labels, i think?) made during the Covid lockdown, by artists under lockdown. so the whole thing is pretty domestic. i listened to some releases on loop during lockdown, adding to the feeling of "shared isolation". all releases are very much worth checking out !

zhao cong - gear, gear https://zoominnight.bandcamp.com/album/gear-gear
both hyper focused and imprevisible, unstructured, at times hyper silent, and then reaching The Rita levels of density.

as soon as you start listening to your environment when you listen to music (and incorporating the future listening context when recording), i'd say that the music questions what you're listening to (the music, the context), and what position is the listener in. you feel more grounded, present, when you listen to something that forces you to acknowledge your material surroundings. for me, it's Gabi Losoncy's work that conveys these feelings the strongest (or at least, what i know of her work). what i've heard from her is just one-take recordings from her phone (saw her play live in paris, she was just playing back something on her phone, recorded on her phone, more of an anti-performance than Vomir). when listening, i know that i know the sounds i hear, but i can't tell from where i know the sounds. this kind of myopy to your surroundings, it doesn't get more domestic than that : )

gabi losoncy, tact is a muscle https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nciKHSGpunE
very, very textural, yet very very domestic (as in, the sounds sound like something you've known forever)

gabi losoncy, security besides love https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s1WGxCamtIw

her release on Lake Shark Harsh Noise is absolutely stunning, both the artwork and the sound, one of the most fascinating releases i've heard in the past years.

finally, not so much domestic, but in the "incorporating its surroundings" and general "informalness" of the sound, jackson pratt's part of his split with shredded nerve (https://www.discogs.com/fr/release/2606 ... dded-Nerve) is very much worth checking out !

(end of the rant. i hope i made some sense / added something to this thread. btw: joined the forum recently, it has been years since i last went on a forum and it is so refreshing to see some actual talk about music online !)

Very interesting---many good points being made here. Your comment on environmental sounds makes me ask a follow-up questions: how are most people listening to noise while in a domestic setting? Are they wearing headphones? Or do they play it out loud as they move through their space (which also affects the reception of the sound)?

Gabi Losoncy is very intriguing, though I am never quite sure how to categorize her work. Like you mention, her recordings sound so environmental, but the artwork that she uses on some of them adds strange additional dimensions that I am uncertain of how to associate (if I even should).

[Cementimental]

Hal McGee is the most domestic noise artist I can think of

[Tribe Tapes]

Hal McGee is the most domestic noise artist I can think of

[papp diin]

This is kind of my approach right now with my limited resources. Have had a lot of interesting results with water taps in particular. Dripping water onto a glass plate, run through a fuzz is pretty cool. An old house I lived in for a bit had a fucked up tap that squealed like all hell when you turned it and I used that a whole lot.

But it's also about listening for interesting things and being curious as to how they would turn out with manipulation. I do analogue photography and the principle is sort of the same - filtering something mundane and making it more ethereal. I think the same principle as junk noise can be applied to just about anything you got lying around the house that makes a noise, and you don't even need to use brute force to "play" it. I'm more into subtly touching something and it making an awful racket.

[DIODE SNORTER]

I also do not consider any sort of “ambient noise” (think PBK, Maeror Tri) as fitting into this rough idea of domestic noise.

I'm curious to dig into what makes Yeast Culture and Regional Bears releases a part of domestic noise for you but not an artist like PBK?

I too am curious to understand what separates "domestic" from "ambient" noise. I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around the concept of noise that "occupies a space rather than distracts from it." Doesn't all noise technically occupy some kind of space?

I know I'm late to the party here. Usually these kinds of discussions don't interest me so I rarely have anything to say, but coincidentally I was thinking of PBK the other day, specifically of this video:



This was one of my very first introductions to the idea of what "noise" was; in present day, I've been calling this kind of stuff "non-harsh noise."

To adult human's point, this kind of stuff——to me——exemplifies the notion of "noise" being an umbrella term for "vastly diverse approaches and practices." There's definitely been a trend away from this more amorphous definition as the internet has grown more organized, codified and rigid: I'm not entirely against this, mind you, but I do think there ought to be a separation between the explicitly "harsh" style——which has, let's face it, been increasingly defined by a broad yet unmistakable set of aural and visual aesthetics——and the less obvious, more experimental styles.

Anyways, just curious: how does that video fit in to the idea of "domestic" noise? From what I understand, I would guess not very well since it doesn't use household objects...?

[Tribe Tapes]

Anyways, just curious: how does that video fit in to the idea of "domestic" noise? From what I understand, I would guess not very well since it doesn't use household objects...?

For domestic noise to use household objects is a literal interpretation of the term, and not entirely what I meant with my initial posting. PBK was inspired by the originators, guys like Xenakis or Mumma. Sure, DSM and other artists I have namedropped were influenced by these same originators. But domestic noise as I see it has a more lowbrow connotation -- rough, haphazard execution. That video of PBK is very clearly one of a man who understands and has perfected his craft.

[Joie de la Blumpy]

quote
Sonic space gets sort of erased and hole punched
unquote

[Happiness, forever]

this thread is really interesting.
[…]

something which explores a similar idea - the familiar sound of chores, daily rituals, errands, all the things required for the maintenance of life - but from a noise perspective would be neat, conceptually, i think. i'm sure it's been done by someone already, in various different ways, but just a thing i was thinking over!

there is!! I cannot for the life of me remember it’s name, and or which label released it, maybe a collaborative…? It’s a compilation. And iirc, it’s all the sounds of packing records and tapes etc for mailorder at RRR shop, Hospital Records (when he had the actual record store below Jammyland), Freak Animal’s record store and maybe someone else…? It was a long time ago so details are fuzzy. I don’t own it.

[adult human]

this thread is really interesting.
[…]

something which explores a similar idea - the familiar sound of chores, daily rituals, errands, all the things required for the maintenance of life - but from a noise perspective would be neat, conceptually, i think. i'm sure it's been done by someone already, in various different ways, but just a thing i was thinking over!

there is!! I cannot for the life of me remember it’s name, and or which label released it, maybe a collaborative…? It’s a compilation. And iirc, it’s all the sounds of packing records and tapes etc for mailorder at RRR shop, Hospital Records (when he had the actual record store below Jammyland), Freak Animal’s record store and maybe someone else…? It was a long time ago so details are fuzzy. I don’t own it.

[papp diin]

Can noise work as furniture music?

This phrase just reminded me of this:



Still harsh as all hell.

[James Thompson]

been thinking of doing a project where i ask my friends to record their walk home, ideally after a night out. just think it could be interesting, both as raw material and for editing. feels fitting for this thread, i think.

[Bubble-Congeries]

been thinking of doing a project where i ask my friends to record their walk home, ideally after a night out. just think it could be interesting, both as raw material and for editing. feels fitting for this thread, i think.

That's a really interesting idea! I like the unpredictabile/chance aspect of sourcing from other people, and also the intimate/personal implications of sourcing them from friends and possibly reading some aspects of the individuals, their sonic footprints (absolutely no corny pun intended) in the recordings. Also, shoes clopping and crunching gravel is already a lovely sound... >_>

[James Thompson]

been thinking of doing a project where i ask my friends to record their walk home, ideally after a night out. just think it could be interesting, both as raw material and for editing. feels fitting for this thread, i think.

That's a really interesting idea! I like the unpredictabile/chance aspect of sourcing from other people, and also the intimate/personal implications of sourcing them from friends and possibly reading some aspects of the individuals, their sonic footprints (absolutely no corny pun intended) in the recordings. Also, shoes clopping and crunching gravel is already a lovely sound... >_>

thanks pal, appreciate it - this encouragement got me to actually start asking a few people earlier today, and the results are immediately super compelling. i'll take some time for more to filter in and then put them together into something, will share on here as it develops.

[k.p.g]

What about "novelty noise?"

[papp diin]

What about "novelty noise?"

Like funny noise? There's not enough of it if you ask me

[The Mysterious Creep]

this thread is really interesting.
[…]

something which explores a similar idea - the familiar sound of chores, daily rituals, errands, all the things required for the maintenance of life - but from a noise perspective would be neat, conceptually, i think. i'm sure it's been done by someone already, in various different ways, but just a thing i was thinking over!

there is!! I cannot for the life of me remember it’s name, and or which label released it, maybe a collaborative…? It’s a compilation. And iirc, it’s all the sounds of packing records and tapes etc for mailorder at RRR shop, Hospital Records (when he had the actual record store below Jammyland), Freak Animal’s record store and maybe someone else…? It was a long time ago so details are fuzzy. I don’t own it.

That's phenomenal. I'm gonna be in MA for the second time soon, have to get over to RRR while I'm there.