Modular Noise

[NoGuard]

Hey,

Just wanted to start a thread for all of us who are making, have made, or are thinking of getting into modular noise. I understand it’s a niche within a niche and I haven’t been doing it long so I’m no expert. Throw up some module and case recommendations, patch ideas or whatever. Hope this appeals to some.

[Remi]

Maybe you'd like to rename the topic "modular noise" then? I know myself and at least another person on here use modular gear to make noise but not eurorack? I'm in the process of leaving the format entirely actually.

And my biggest recommendation would be for anyone who gets into that stuff to get a decent power supply (like a 4ms Row Power 30 or 40 for instance.) A case is what it is, but decent power makes a ton of difference, like no unwanted buzz, no problems powering some particular modules, etc.

[NoGuard]

Good point. Renamed. Yeh power supply is big.

[NoGuard]

I picked up an ALM Busy Circuits SBG, which lets you run pedals through a modular rig. Can get some great stuff running a simple oscillator through that, which can obviously be modulated, for some more complex feedback/pedal loop sounds.

[Exclusionzonedayton]

Long time modular user. Noise and experimental. I agree on power. Never can have too much and good quality power is best. It costs more initially but it’s worth it. As for modules, two or more Flight of Harmony Plague Bearers (I use 2 live and 2 more at home) will go a long way. I like the WMD uHadron Collider. Many of the Erica Synths modules have a lot of great noise potential. The 4ms noise swash is cool. I don’t really have a lot of esoteric modules but it seems like there’s plenty of wild stuff there.

[-NRRRRK-]

Got curious about modular stuff some weeks ago, a buddy then told my about VCV Rack and I went right down that rabbit hole.
Decided to start building a hardware rack this year. Case will be DIY, power will be a uZeus.

[MiseryEngine]

My first release was 100% modular and my second was like 80%. I didn’t get away from it until recently to be honest but I did eventually go fully into elektron gear and my 404. I found modular to be super fun but I lost patience with the process. Personally, I feel I may return to it sometime though as now I have really learned a lot about MIDI and MIDI to CV that could really change the possibilities of a smaller modular setup immensely. The Octatrack having 3 MIDI LFOs per channel for instance…

[Remi]

What ultimately matters is finding one' s own workflow with that stuff. My Euro case is nothing like what I thought it'd be or wanted it to be a few years ago.

I do use it for sound making out of convenience sometimes now (although it's coming from the 4U Serge 99% of the time now) but I use modular for processing and sound shaping now, feeding it plenty of stuff and twisting it all to taste. Like, say, Mack has been praising the Prism stuff for instance. He's right, it sounds amazing and is very powerful. Do I need it? Absolutely not at all, it doesn't fit with what I do. And I think that what keeps me with Euro now is that the Ritual Electronics modules are an integrant part of my workflow. If they were 4u, I'd leave the Euro format right away.

Soundwise, I like the Serge better because it sounds like manipulating raw electricity and obliges you to go back to the basics in terms of patching, kind of Doepfer-style, but the patch programmability does that any module can become something else according to how you patch it, and happy accidents are numerous and often useful. I feel like it's less the case with euro, in which most makers now seem to sell you full voices in single modules, which defeats the point of modular synths to me? I do understand how useful and nice that is when one is beginning though, and as eurorack market is exploding, it makes sense to create these kind of modules to get more people into it and hopefully they'll get creative with them.

Final point I'd like to make. After getting up to 12u worth of modules, I realised I was using only the equivalent of 3u worth of stuff in my rack and that I didn't need more. It actually became overwhelming and even stressful for me to sit in front of the rack, to the point I'd often take like 3 or 4 modules out of the rack to put them in a smaller case and only use that those on their own. That's actually pretty good practice as it taught me a lot about the modules I had and used often, kind of forcing me to learn them better? And to be quite honest, one can never know Maths well enough.

Sorry, lots of rambling.

[searchofexit]

I started buying eurorack modules a few years ago but didn't have a case until February or March 2020. Someone offered me a bundle deal of a bunch of modules and two Tip Top Happy Ending kits so those were my first case and first time I powered the modules I had. I already had a few Arturia synths already so I got 6u Rackbrute and that's where I'm at now. Recently got a good deal on a Dreadbox 6U case so that is another case to learn.

It's true when they say Eurocrack. I think "well these 1u modules look good maybe I should get an Intellijel case so I can use them". I definitely started buying more once I got a case. Big rabbit hole but I don't regret getting into it. I tried to get a few friends who use desktop synths into it but no luck yet.

I haven't gotten to the point where I use only my eurorack for anything I do. I like to use desktop synths and pedals. I use eurorack as an effects processor mainly but I also have voices coming out of it into other modules.

[Rzortachi]

I leaped into the deep end with zero knowledge but have it capped at 3u x 84 so I don’t go overboard and can learn it well. I bought a module to convert signal to and from pedals so I can run the contact mic-pedal array through the eurorack filter. Great for dialing In gritty texture. Then I have a hyperfist digital oscillator for noise/drone and a analogue oscillator all controlled via a beatstep pro. Dual ADSR. The last module I bought was the FX Aid XL for many different reverbs, delays, and other effects to give these oscillators some life. It’s coming along. I have a drum module but it’s not getting much use. Next up is something for logic or burst.

[Exclusionzonedayton]

2hp burst generator is small, inexpensive and does the job. If you want simple, check that one out. I had one but ended up selling it because I had another module that could do burst but less controlled though (wogglebug v1)

[parasitenurse]

I started out with eurorack also with zero knowledge and just the help of a friend. My pedal rig was too large and heavy for me to realistically cart around to shows, despite doing it a handful of times, and i wanted something more manageable. I got one of those trogotronic 6u 84hp cases and at this point its all but full. Waiting on a couple modules in the mail and the rig will be complete. Been getting *tons* of use out of the morphagene both for cut up stuff and breakcore drum samples. Its truly a magic machine. I havent tried any ambient out with it as of yet since i have half a row dedicated to ambient already (pams, o_c, plaits, tiptop zverb) but from the videos ive seen it works wonders for ambient. Waiting on a godeater prototype and a make noise xpan currently, so ive still got things to look forward to.

After having built this rig i definitely want to dive deeper into making synth music and not strictly cut up/ambient. Definitely open to wavetable oscillator recommendations since its unclear whether or not the hertz donut will be available any time soon.

[Exclusionzonedayton]

Lots of good wavetable oscillators out there. Here’s my thoughts on the ones I’ve used, and of course there are tons more out there.

My favorite I’ve ever used is the Hertz Donut 3. Just amazing. Having dual is huge. But you know that.

I’ve had a Hertz Donut 1 and it was ok. I sold it and don’t miss it. The 3 blows it away. Never used a HD 2

The Syn Tech E350 Morphing Terrarium is my second favorite. It’s not as capable of being dirty like the Hertz Donut but sounds very bizarre and can be made dirty after it. Probably could be found affordable.

Never used the E352 Cloud Terrarium but one of my friends has it and has used it well. It seems like a super Morphing Terrarium so I expect I would like it.

Erica Synths Black Wavetable VCO sounds good as a wavetable oscillator but it doesn’t go as low as I like.

Erica Synths Graphic VCO. Better than the Black wavetable VCO. Still doesn’t quite do low the way I like but the additional capabilities make it still really good.

Pittsburgh Modular DNA. Great if you can find one, not made anymore. Gets pretty nasty sounding. You would probably like it.

That’s all I can think of that I’ve used. I haven’t bought a lot of new stuff for a while and don’t know many people with modulars.

[parasitenurse]

Lots of good wavetable oscillators out there. Here’s my thoughts on the ones I’ve used, and of course there are tons more out there.

My favorite I’ve ever used is the Hertz Donut 3. Just amazing. Having dual is huge. But you know that.

I’ve had a Hertz Donut 1 and it was ok. I sold it and don’t miss it. The 3 blows it away. Never used a HD 2

The Syn Tech E350 Morphing Terrarium is my second favorite. It’s not as capable of being dirty like the Hertz Donut but sounds very bizarre and can be made dirty after it. Probably could be found affordable.

Never used the E352 Cloud Terrarium but one of my friends has it and has used it well. It seems like a super Morphing Terrarium so I expect I would like it.

Erica Synths Black Wavetable VCO sounds good as a wavetable oscillator but it doesn’t go as low as I like.

Erica Synths Graphic VCO. Better than the Black wavetable VCO. Still doesn’t quite do low the way I like but the additional capabilities make it still really good.

Pittsburgh Modular DNA. Great if you can find one, not made anymore. Gets pretty nasty sounding. You would probably like it.

That’s all I can think of that I’ve used. I haven’t bought a lot of new stuff for a while and don’t know many people with modulars.

wow thanks for the in depth recommendations! ive heard mixed things about the erica synth oscillators but im definitely going to check out the morphing terrarium. i dont mind throwing some dirt on it later in the patch if thats what it takes, i planned on having at least one distortion unit in this next case as it is.

[Exclusionzonedayton]

Morphing terrarium are stupidly expensive right now on Reverb…. Cloud terrarium aren’t that much more…. A forum classified may have more reasonable prices. So much used stuff is insanely over priced right now.

[Exclusionzonedayton]

@parasitenurse I got to play a Cloud Terrarium again. Like a morphing terrarium deluxe. It covers some territory closer to the PH that you would probably like. If you can find the morphing for a good price it’s worth it. If they stay high, it’s probably worth saving the extra for the cloud terrarium if you have the rack space.

[parasitenurse]

@parasitenurse I got to play a Cloud Terrarium again. Like a morphing terrarium deluxe. It covers some territory closer to the PH that you would probably like. If you can find the morphing for a good price it’s worth it. If they stay high, it’s probably worth saving the extra for the cloud terrarium if you have the rack space.

this is going in a brand new case so ill def have room. ive seen it on modular grid but didnt look too deeply into it. i found a morphing terrarium with the expander for like $330 but i dont want the expander and $330 is almost what they cost new so like if i can get something close to the piston honda for a little extra ill probably pull the trigger on that. thanks for the heads up!

[heavyelectronix]

What ultimately matters is finding one' s own workflow with that stuff. My Euro case is nothing like what I thought it'd be or wanted it to be a few years ago.

I feel like it's less the case with euro, in which most makers now seem to sell you full voices in single modules, which defeats the point of modular synths to me? I do understand how useful and nice that is when one is beginning though, and as eurorack market is exploding, it makes sense to create these kind of modules to get more people into it and hopefully they'll get creative with them.

And to be quite honest, one can never know Maths well enough.

Sorry, lots of rambling.

Definitely some interesting thoughts here (some of which I cropped out for the sake of space). I have considered going 4u but since solidifying my rig I see myself staying in Euro land for the foreseeable future.

I think the main theme I'm seeing here is the difference in design philosophy between 4u and 3u world. I agree completely that a lot of the "one stop shop" euro modules completely defeat the purpose in some regards, particularly the digital ones. You might as well just use VCV rack and call it a day. I see a lot of rigs out there that do not have to exist in physical form at all; I see people making techno with $5k plus of hardware that is available as software for free or much less. Many of these modules are also incapable of making sounds outside of their small and specific range. Noise Engineering and Mutable Instruments are the worst offenders, in my experience. Even the controllable parameters act more like a set of presets than well... parameters.

That being said, I think there are some manufacturers in Euroland who are making some really good shit. Industrial Music Electronics, Schlappi Engineering, Nonlinearcircuits, Animal Factory, Joranalogue, Make Noise and Metasonix all make very excellent and fundamental building blocks for synthesis. IME and Metasonix in particular are what kept me 3u, although Metasonix does make 4u stuff now (which I highly recommend you investigate if you ever need more nastiness).

This format allows me to carefully craft digital sounds and then obliterate them with tube and solid state devices. I think it gives a modern edge to the classic noise and industrial palette; it's an approach I find satisfying, anyway.

How do you think Maths compares to the DUSG? I generally get laughed at for thinking Maths is superior.

[Remi]

Well, to be honest, I don't think it's fair to compare 3U to 4U because there are many brands with their own size, power, jacks, etc factors within those categories whose approaches are totally different. And even if you go Euro vs Buchla/Serge that wouldn't work either because Buchla and Serge don't follow the same patching logic, Buchla uses two different kind of cables (Banana and tini jacks for audio) whereas Serge only uses banana, they're not compatible power wise (Buchla is 15V and Serge 12V), and then they don't follow the same patching philosophy due to their architecture.

What is certain is that makers decided to make Eurorack their format of choice as a gateway into the modular world for practical reasons but besides the size and power of modules, there's never been a real consensus within the format either. There are still powering differences and whatnot that prevent Eurorack from being a harmonious format for instance (which is why you need attenuators, inverters, etc.)

And I won't judge anyone's rig or the music they make with them. Like, it's up to everyone, and its cost as well. There's no right rig, no right format, no right music. It's only a matter of taste. I've never liked digital sound sources in my modular synths. I don't get the appeal of IME (terrible design too imho) or Qu-Bit modules but I do understand why they make their way in Koufar's music for instance. I don't like Koufar's music but they sure know why they use such and such modules and it serves their music, which is the whole point. But I believe people should get vanilla modules first and then find their own workflow and sounds by spicing it up. Very peculiar or modules with strong personalities make you either sound like everyone else or impersonal (see Strymon pedals as well for instance.)

And that's why I only partially agree with your comments about Mutable Instruments. Émilie from MI did everything right from the get-go in my humble opinion. Her modules are packed with crazy capabilities, Easter eggs and whatnot but what she didn't expect was 98% of her consumers only being satisfied with the tip of the iceberg. "Rings into Clouds" sound nice to a certain extent but has been overused and made bland by scenes that built everything around patching laziness. I won't blame fans of MI ambient either, to each their own, but most of them act like people who buy Ferrari cars to drive in the city. I think MI modules are usually quite underused in general compared to what they can technically do. I believe that's what ended up pushing Emilie away from Eurorack. She's always set the bar too high in terms of expectations.

And then, again, the brands you mentioned that make good stuff, yeah I won't tell you the opposite. But it's just a matter of personal taste. They're very oriented soundwise and won't fit at all for someone like me who needs very plain interfaces and a rather basic synthesis approach. I don't really like the sound of wavetable synthesis when used in a modular context, I find bitcrushers atrocious, etc. But that's my take on it, so I'll skip IME or Schlapppi Engineering right away for instance.

I like NLC modules for the more generative or random mess they can create. And I wish I liked Metasonix much more than I do. They look atrocious, terrible module names, power nightmares, and I'm not the biggest fan of what I heard from them but I'm super glad they exist. They're forward-thinking and bring a spirit of mad scientist gear that is much needed in a nowadays tame format.

I didn't keep Maths long enough while I had a DUSG to make an accurate comparison, and they're both deep modules I don't understand fully so please take my opinion with a grain of salt. Maths is more interesting in a Euro system because it takes less space to do more things than a DUSG and we know how expensive Eurorack real estate is. Serge fans usually care less about that. Basically, Maths is at first a slope generator, a cv processor, and has offsets. You can also use it as a primitive mixer. You need 3 basic Serge modules to achieve the same kind of functionality : a DUSG, a Dual Processor (I love that one, I use mine all the time to mangle CV or as a mixer) and a Peak And Trough (I'll have that one in my incoming boat.) So Maths beats the DUSG in terms of functionality and space. On the other hand, while Maths can create longer enveloppes than a DUSG, the DUSG's are notoriously snappier and handle audio rate much better than Maths, which makes the DUSG much more suitable to use as a VCO than Maths. As a matter of fact, I use mine as a VCO all the time. It's common practice in Serge to use the DTG (Dual Transient Generator, kind of one half of the DUSG) as a VCO in some boats to make them more self-contained. For instance, if you look at the Mantra panel by Random Source, the Dual Slopes in it is the DTG, and the DUSG XL is a DUSG + Peak And Trough. The other advantage, although that may be debatable but I know where I stand already, is that three dedicated modules allow for better, or more complete, functionality here. Maths saves you space but the DUSG + P&T + DPRC combo allows you to go even deeper in whatever it is you want to do with them. And that's great, especially for feedback. Actually, I got into 4U Serge through a DIY panel that contained a DUSG, a DPRC, a Resonant Equalizer and a Wave Multipliers. It's extremely deep already (and an insane feedback machine.) Like, with a DUSG only, I'll make one side of it cycle like VCO and I'll use the other side to act as a filter that'll selfcycle depending on my settings. That's also 3 functions in a single module.
And finally, but that's totally subjective, the panel interface on most Serge modules is so much clearer than Make Noise's. Sure, the paperface symbols get some time to get used to (I don't like them) but Make Noise modules are hell to use for people like me. I actually bought an extra plain panel for my Maths so the module would be devoid of any weird symbols, lightnings and arrows that made no sense and didn't bring anything to the functionality.
Oh, and let's not forget that patching a DUSG with banana jacks that you can stack is much more interesting and different than patching a Maths with the regular Euro jacks unless you use múltiples.

Sorry, I wrote lots.

[W.K.]

Yeah modular is cool, definitely thought me a lot about synthesis and what you can actually do with the elements that build a sound, rather than just have the sound available as-is. Sold most of my modules because it didn't make sense to me to be using modular for the more straight forward noise / synth approach I was going for but still have some modules and might get something like a 4ms Pod for the future for them, they seem to be handy yet not too pricey. Don't know, still lusting for an Erica Synth Black System, maybe sometime.

Pittsburgh Modular DNA. Great if you can find one, not made anymore. Gets pretty nasty sounding. You would probably like it.

Had one for years on sale, no one seemed to want one with all the new fancy modules coming out. I think Pittsburgh even planned a extended version at one point with more modulation capabilities, more algorithms and FX but unfortunately it shelved for other projects (i.e. Lifeforms). The DNA is a cool wavetable VCO but also pretty digital, so good for cold and harsh sounds but don't expect any traditional "synth warmth" from it. Fun to use but in my opinion lacks in modulation options.

I see a lot of rigs out there that do not have to exist in physical form at all; I see people making techno with $5k plus of hardware that is available as software for free or much less. Many of these modules are also incapable of making sounds outside of their small and specific range. Noise Engineering and Mutable Instruments are the worst offenders, in my experience. Even the controllable parameters act more like a set of presets than well... parameters.

So $5K modular techno is bad but $5K modular noise is good? What about the guys having multiple $10K systems but only creating bleeps and bloops or ambient?

But I do get it, with all the fancy new modules the more simple modules seems to be neglected which are often as much as useful and effective, sometimes have a better use by not being over-designed for a particular purpose or sound.

[heavyelectronix]

So $5K modular techno is bad but $5K modular noise is good? What about the guys having multiple $10K systems but only creating bleeps and bloops or ambient?

But I do get it, with all the fancy new modules the more simple modules seems to be neglected which are often as much as useful and effective, sometimes have a better use by not being over-designed for a particular purpose or sound.

That wasn't a knock against any genre in particular. The point I was making is that there are euro rack systems which could literally be accomplished in VCV rack, they are just code and I really don't see the point of creating a whole system out of modules like that. A few mixed with analog? Sure, but to me the desire to physically turn knobs on software doesn't really make sense, plus most of that stuff sounds lame.

The price tag on a Buchla or a Serge might seem ridiculous to a lot of us, but at least with those you can't do literally the exact same thing with software. I don't think a Buchla oscillator which is like ten times the price of a lot of it's Euro counterparts is ten times better, but at least the Buchla is still unique and interesting.

[Residual / RT]

A friend of mine does some noise-adjacent stuff with modular (https://brownhillmafia.bandcamp.com/album/virta) and his rig is really cool. Lot's of possibilities to process feedback, for example reverb tail from processed sample modulates oscillators and then gets re-processed by different modules. Very subtle stuff but makes for very interesting sounds that would be cumbersome to replicate with any other setup I think. Talking with him has got me very interested in modular, but I'd have to sell my whole setup to afford anything decent, meaning a Make Noise shared system or similar.

[Crimesofthecrown777]

If there's anything I find annoying as fuck are people with 5k systems and they make just bleeps and bloops or its their fun cute hobby.

[Remi]

So $5K modular techno is bad but $5K modular noise is good? What about the guys having multiple $10K systems but only creating bleeps and bloops or ambient?

But I do get it, with all the fancy new modules the more simple modules seems to be neglected which are often as much as useful and effective, sometimes have a better use by not being over-designed for a particular purpose or sound.

That wasn't a knock against any genre in particular. The point I was making is that there are euro rack systems which could literally be accomplished in VCV rack, they are just code and I really don't see the point of creating a whole system out of modules like that. A few mixed with analog? Sure, but to me the desire to physically turn knobs on software doesn't really make sense, plus most of that stuff sounds lame.

The price tag on a Buchla or a Serge might seem ridiculous to a lot of us, but at least with those you can't do literally the exact same thing with software. I don't think a Buchla oscillator which is like ten times the price of a lot of it's Euro counterparts is ten times better, but at least the Buchla is still unique and interesting.

Some people are fine with making music by clicking and pointing on stuff and some don't. I need to twist knobs, patch stuff and make it happen physically the same way I want to bash drumkits and break strings on my bass like an idiot when I play. Why does it matter to anyone, actually?
Also, Arturia made plenty of emulations of rare or expensive synths that sound quite bang on to say the least (I'm thinking about the Synthi, the Easel, old string machines, the Mellotron, etc.) If you heard them on record, you wouldn't hear the difference between the real machine or their digital versions so I don't get your point.

[marciume]

I got into modular first and foremost to (re)create Berlin school sounds and vibes. I was lucky enough to find a "full system" second hand for a great price and then expanded it with other modules which were selected according to my needs. Fortunately, in that first system there were also some Mutable Instruments modules such as Plaits and Rings. As Remi already said and as we already discussed more than once in private, MI is way deeper than what you usually see and hear from youtube videos. Combined with for example analog filters and phasers they can generate very cool sounds. Without having to make some use out of them in the first place, I would have probably thought that they were not for me.
Anyway, when I started getting sucked into this new world I tried to keep the Berlin school thing in another compartment from my noise activities. This allowed me to focus on the functionality of each module and build patches with a healthy dose of "discipline". After getting enough confidence, I started to include the modular system into my noise workflow (pedals, tape, contact mics, etc.). Beside the obvious infinite enlargement of possibilities and combinations, what made me laugh and enjoy this approach is the way I started to rethink about feedback paths: by applying the "classic" modular techniques that include VCAs all over the place, I'm rediscovering the pleasure of playing with feedback.

When it comes to sound and if I had to choose one core component, I'm personally still in love with the Pittsburgh Modular SV-1. The VCOs do not track very well when compared to other brands but they sound great. The filter and the envelope are pure perfection.
Compared to working with pedals, the biggest advantage of modular is that you can repatch more quickly and easily. In the end however, nobody needs modular to create and enjoy making noise/music. It is more about the process than the final result. Last but not least, money is also important: do not get into modular if you can't afford it and if you are impulsive... Make a plan and stick to it.